Typescript 2023-09-06

10:13:25

10:13:25 From Robert Sterbal Jeff, great work on the indexing

10:13:36 From Jeff Miller ty! all credit to Ward for the scripts

10:13:43 From Robert Sterbal can you add a link back to where your found the text? (point in the document)

10:14:21 From Jeff Miller oh hmm (thinks) I guess you could use Google fragment search? #:~:text=

10:14:34 From Robert Sterbal I used sectionss

10:14:58 From Jeff Miller oh right because there are timestamps on the formatted script I haven't actually looked at Ward's script source, let me take a look

10:15:14 From Robert Sterbal https://sterbalssundrystudies.miraheze.org/wiki/Bookmarks_0-Z

10:16:07 From Jeff Miller C2 without javascript is a little flat

10:16:10 From Robert Sterbal i.e.- ===Bookmarks C|C=== in mediawiki markdown

10:17:39 From Marc Pierson Is anyone interested in seeing what Chris and I have been doing with the EIP Sketch? I have to leave at 11 to work with Chris and Kerry before presenting this work to an east costs group at noon.

10:19:22 From Jeff Miller aggregate KWIC index of everything "EIP Sketch" ? Ward's case: if we had a KWIC index of everything, and you recalled someone mentioning a topic with a URL, it could take you to the chat log

10:20:23 From Paul Rodwell Marc , It would be nice to see what you and Chris have been doing.

10:20:51 From Jeff Miller Also (says Ward): just every URL as a special KWIC index could be useful. Marc says: Chris and I have been working for the past couple of days on a EIP sketch, and here's a causal loop diagram.

10:23:28

10:23:28 From Jeff Miller "I keep being confused as to why people can't see the power of this approach, of the ecology / institutions / politics diagram; if we take the generic things on the ecology levels, and give them particular names, THAT shows people what it's about; and each of the named levels has a page on it, Aliveness of The New Addition Neighborhood, Aliveness of AZ State, Aliveness of the North American Treaty Alliance and in ecology, Aliveness of the Copper Corridor so that it's a causal loop diagram, with particulars that people can identify with personally in places and groups that they're part of."

10:25:06 From Brian I have dentist apt, so have to leave in a couple minutes. I ran across https://zettelkasten.de/introduction/ that I think overlays with a lot of the fedwiki conversations. "You should always translate information to knowledge by adding context and relevance." Maybe it was even an early influence and I'm rediscovering the history/origins. Have a good week.

10:25:40 From Jeff Miller Marc says: "Here's the least abstract part of this diagram, Aliveness of My Side of the Creek. There's a lot of writing to be done, but this sketch, in a generic form, is a pattern; when you situate it in a location, with people, and add the five-star survey for the components of aliveness, that can be a way of getting information from people." Ward asks: are you learning new things?

10:26:01 From Paul Rodwell http://marc.relocalizecreativity.net/regen-development-fund.html

10:27:15 From Jeff Miller Marc says: Chris took the diagram and used it to talk with decision-makers. I like to think about "how can I use this technique everywhere?" Chris took this and particularized it, and those particulars made it easy for people to relate to, and easy to answer questions about whether a particular institution helps or hinders, and how." paraphrase Ward thinks about reviving driver diagrams, Vensim into Wiki etc.

10:28:25 From Jeff Miller Marc says: Vensim only allows you to create driver trees two levels deep if you're not a $$ subscriber. (Ward/Marc: so we can pull it into Wiki and create driver trees there) Or perhaps Neo4J would be a way of doing things; Marc asks: how we might handle arrows in the FedWiki? Ward says: we've handled them in various ways.

10:29:52 From Jeff Miller Marc says: I'm talking to a public health officer who's very interested in this technique, but we're more interested in putting it into the hands of folks like Chris. Ward recalls that it's possible to extract structure from a rendered SVG, and that if we can download them in that way, then we can use that as useful input.

10:31:15 From Jeff Miller Marc considers the Cypher queries as a possible source; Ward says that the layout is as important as the Cypher queries. Marc says: we could export both and put them on the same page. "nothing keeping us from exporting GraphQL and/or JSON into the same page"

10:32:27 From Jeff Miller Marc is excited about the usability jump for normal people who are seeing the way in which conversations can be driven from the EIP Sketch tool, once enough particulars are added to make a situation relatable. Ward points out that Chris is good at putting an extra relationship node into a diagram for "don't forget this" and then (hopefully) seeing the driver trees etc. updated.

10:33:57 From Jeff Miller 1. Vensim: gives us formulas as text, won't give pictures we need.
2. Arrows.app : a good source for useful SVG input to wiki? Marc says that "it feels great that after ten years of Marc Pierson's brain seeing it, that other people are seeing the power of these diagrams"

10:36:03 From Jeff Miller Marc says: getting Chris involved, making him the front for the effort, that gives the power of making the effort grounded.

Ward: and then we would take Chris's work and fold it back into how the tool takes input and feedback, and SHOW what we've done there, as a result of Chris's effort. Marc says: The Supercollaborator has been a great demonstration of how we might explore overlapping driver diagrams, things that come out of the efforts for the EIP related systems work.

10:37:45 From Jeff Miller Ward says: Paul's improvements to the Supercollaborator support much bigger diagrams. Thompson likes to zoom around a diagram, a graph, and to point out things; he finds the large diagram view useful to his thinking.

10:38:17 From Robert Sterbal It would also be nice to have a header on the index 0-9 * A * B * C * D * E * F * G * H * I * J * K * L * M * N * O * P * Q * R * S * T * U * V * W * X * Y * Z

10:38:18 From Jeff Miller Ward points out: click handling doesn't work for the expanded view of a diagram, maybe it would be helpful to preserve the click dispatching then. oops zoom stole my focus

10:38:32 From Robert Sterbal or some 2 level format

10:38:55 From Jeff Miller Ward says: Paul's improvements to the Supercollaborator support much bigger diagrams. Thompson likes to zoom around a diagram, a graph, and to point out things; he finds the large diagram view useful to his thinking. (growls at Zoom stealing cursor focus)

10:41:57

10:41:57 From Jeff Miller (Ward describes his experience in a maze cave with a low ceiling) oh right twisty little passages all alike twisty little passages all different a maze of twisty little 
a twisty little maze of
a little twisty maze of

10:43:25 From Jeff Miller Colossal Cave Adventure v1 - mostly the cave map Colossal Cave Adventure v2 - puzzles etc. (from Ward's account)

10:52:18

10:52:18 From Jeff Miller hexagrams? I missed that.

10:53:58 From Paul Rodwell slugs are a to z (upper/lower case) and numbers

10:54:27 From Jeff Miller alphanumeric-and-hyphens H-char-## H hexagram unicode 63

10:55:31 From Jeff Miller for "After Completion"

10:55:32 From Robert Best Can page titles just be a number?

10:57:01 From Jeff Miller https://codepoints.net/U+4DC2 ䷂

10:58:16 From Robert Sterbal Is there a talk page on a locked wiki page? I wanted to update Index to KWIC Index on this page? http://jeff.dojo.fed.wiki/view/transcript-suggestions

10:58:29 From Jeff Miller what's a talk page? oh you mean like MediaWiki thanks! http://jeff.dojo.fed.wiki/view/typescript-archive/view/typescript-transcripts/view/transcript-suggestions

10:59:41 From Jeff Miller try dragging the page over

11:01:04 From Jeff Miller Robert S. observes that the cancel button doesn't work on the reclaim code entry for jeff.dojo.fed.wiki (while "escape" works) aha, "Please fill out this field" "no"

11:02:37 From Jeff Miller what is the list of subdomains for dojo.fed.wiki (for Robert S) hmm robert.dojo.fed.wiki is Robert Best?

11:04:47 From Jeff Miller (Robert Best suggests searching for emails from ward@c2.com for a reclaim code) Feb 1st 2022 ; Peter D also says 2022.

11:06:24 From Robert Sterbal http://jeff.dojo.fed.wiki/view/typescript-transcripts/view/transcript-suggestions

11:08:45 From Robert Sterbal https://sterbalssundrystudies.miraheze.org/wiki/Bookmarks_0-Z

11:16:56

11:16:56 From Jeff Miller http://jeff.dojo.fed.wiki/view/typescript-archive/view/transcript-suggestions/view/x4dc2

11:17:23 From Robert Best Are we there yet?

11:17:39 From Peter Dimitrios https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lDK9QqIzhwk

11:18:16 From Robert Best Co-pilots of this zoom ship

11:18:49 From Peter Dimitrios https://youtu.be/lDK9QqIzhwk?t=95